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| − | {{Cleanup}} | + | {{historical}} |
| − | {{Work in Progress}}
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| − | * This page has a workbench section containing bulk information contributed by other members. Feel free to assist in simplifying / edditing appropriate information and transfering it back to here. The focus for this page is currently on readibility and target audience (Eve Uni Students). Technical specifics are secondary at this point.
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| − | * The Work Bench Page Can be found here: [[Logistic Guide Workbench]]
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| − | [[Category:Guides]]
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| − | [[Category:PvP]]
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| − | [[Category:Ships]]
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| − | | |
| − | ==Introduction==
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| − | Logistic cruisers are designed to remotely repair friendly ships. They can be used both in PvE and PvP fleets. They require a fair amount of training and thus are usually out of reach for most young combat pilots. This guide provides general tactics for Logistic pilots.<br><br>
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| − | There are four logistic cruisers two repair shields and two repair armor. The four logistic cruisers are further subdivided into the categories of co-op logistics or solo logistics.
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| − | ===Co-op Logistics===
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| − | :[[Guardian]] and [[Basilisk]]:
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| − | ::Co-op logistic ships have six high slots, recieve a bonus to cap transfer modules and are best fitted with large remote armor repair or large shield transfer modules. They are not cap stable alone and have to utilize cap transfer modules with another logi ship to be cap stable. They are best utilized in large fleet engagements repairing battle cruisers and battleship sized friendlies.
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| − | | |
| − | ===Solo Logistics===
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| − | :[[Scimitar]] and [[Oneiros]]:
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| − | ::Solo logistics ship have a more balanced midslot layout, less powergrid, but significantly higher capacitor potential. They receive a bonuses to tracking links, potentially increasing effective DPS on fleet targets. They are best utilized in small skirmish fleets fitted with medium repair modules for use on frigate and cruiser sized ships where the smaller sig radius helps compensate for lower repping power.
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| − | ===T1 Logistics===
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| − | :[[Osprey]] and [[Exequror]]
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| − | :: While not as usefull as their T2 counterparts, these ships make excellent training vessels for newer pilots. The [[Osprey]] is a shield repper [[Exequror]] is for armor. Both are best utilized with small remote armor repairs or micro shield transfer arrays (respectively) and fielded to compliment cheap T1 frigates and cruisers. These ships also see a lot of service in the emergency repair of Player Owned Structures and stations due to their cheap costs and low skill requirements, enabling a corp or alliance to have every member available to quickly restore a damaged structure.<br><br>
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| − | | |
| − | ==Why Fly Logistics?==
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| − | So your curious about flying a logistics ship! Great! Logistic ships can potentially turn the tide of any battle, allow a smaller fleet to decimate a larger one, save player owned structures, and generally gain the respect and instant love of everyone in your fleet. Flying a logistics ship will give you a perspective of fleet combat usually only noticed by a fleet commander (in respect to the health and status of his own fleet). You will also begin to develop a keen ability to multi task, juggling reps between multiple targets, flying your ship to stay alive and keeping track of the status of the battle you're engaged in.<br><br>
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| − | Things to keep in mind about logistics play:<br><br>
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| − | * Logistics are not for kill mail junkies. If you're a dedicated logistics pilot truly doing their job you can go a month or more without ever getting onto a kill mail, but you and your fleet mates know you're an important part of their success as a team. <br><br>
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| − | * You need to be prepaired to loose your ship every time you undock. Logistics boats are constantly primaried in every engagement they are spotted in, and are often exploded. If your corporation has a ship replacement program, check to see how often and under what circumstances their reimbursment policy takes effect and stick to it. If not, have your income in order to be able to replace your ships at 150 million isk a pop.<br><br>
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| − | | |
| − | * Logistics Ships are skill Intensive: <br><br> The training time to get into and properly fly a logistics ship can easily take four to six months for a new player. Many of the skills do not translate well to direct combat, potentially hurting your income potential from missioning / ratting. Logistics skills in no way translate to industry skills. Because of this most pilots don't start cross training into logistics untill they have their heavy assult, battle cruiser, or battleship skills in order for income purposes.<br><br>
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| − | * Try it out before you decide to train for it:<br><br> There are two T1 cruisers available to test the waters for logistics ships. If you want to give it a go early in your career, or test the waters before putting in for the intensive skill plan, grab one and use them in the mass t1 frigate or cruiser fleets. You won't keep too many ships alive, but you could make a big difference in the usually short life of the fast tacklers.<br><br> Try them out! The T1 rep hero ships are the [[Osprey]] and [[Exequror]].<br><br>
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| − | ==Logistics Quick Start - Go Go Go!==
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| − | | |
| − | So, you've read all the warnings and are still wanting to try it eh? Go and grab an [[Osprey]] or [[Exequror]]: <br>
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| − | {{Fittings
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| − | |name=Osprey, PvP RR
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| − | | |
| − | | |
| − | |high=
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| − | Medium Shield Transporter I<br>Medium Shield Transporter I<br>Empty High Slot<br>Empty High Slot
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| − | |mid=10mn Afterburner I<br>Infulnerability Field I<br>Large Shield Extender I<br>Medium Capacitor Booster I
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| − | |low=
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| − | Damage Control I<br>Co-Processor I<br>Co-Processor I
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| − | | |
| − | |charges=
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| − | Cap Booster 800
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| − | | |
| − | |drones=
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| − | Hornet EC-300 x4
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| − | | |
| − | |rigs=
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| − | [empty rig slot]<br>
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| − | [empty rig slot]<br>
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| − | [empty rig slot]
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| − | | |
| − | | |
| − | |recommended1=
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| − | | |
| − | |recommended2=
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| − | | |
| − | |recommended3=
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| − | | |
| − | | |
| − | |notes=
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| − | Basic T1 Osprey Fit. Same reps as 4x small shield transporters but reps out to 32 KM.
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| − | }}{{Fittings
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| − | |name=Exequror, PvP RR
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| − | | |
| − | |high=
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| − | Small Remote Armor Repair System I<br>
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| − | Small Remote Armor Repair System I<br>
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| − | Small Remote Armor Repair System I<br>
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| − | Small Remote Armor Repair System I
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| − | |mid=
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| − | 10MN MicroWarpdrive I<br>
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| − | Tracking Disruptor I<br>
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| − | Tracking Disruptor I<br>
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| − | Medium Capacitor Booster I
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| − | |low=
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| − | Damage Control I<br>
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| − | 800mm Reinforced Steel Plates I<br>
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| − | Adaptive Nano Plating I
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| − | | |
| − | |charges=
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| − | Optimal Range Disruption<br>
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| − | Cap Booster 800
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| − | |drones=
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| − | Vespa EC-600 x3<br>
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| − | Hornet EC-300 x2
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| − | |rigs=
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| − | [empty rig slot]<br>
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| − | [empty rig slot]<br>
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| − | [empty rig slot]
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| − | | |
| − | |recommended1=
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| − | |recommended2=
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| − | |recommended3=
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| − | | |
| − | |notes=
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| − | *Small RR range on an Exeq is 24 km.
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| − | *Meant for Uni members looking to practice logistics before getting into proper T2 logistic ships.
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| − | }}<br><br>
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| − | ===Find a low end fleet===
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| − | :...Preferably one of the t1 frigate roams as you will have the potential for success there.<br><br>
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| − | Don't worry about your overview settings at this point, just make sure you have your overview setup for PVP and your broadcast window open.
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| − | * Tell your FC in fleet chat that your in a T1 logistics ship. Follow their instructions (if any).
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| − | * Stay with the fleet and fly your ship in formation as you would any other ship. Your not THAT special. (orbit gates, orbit primaries, align, etc.)
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| − | * Add your fleet commander, any other logistics ships, and a few of your friends to your watch list. You can lock them up to apply reps from this window if they take damage.
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| − | * Keep your broadcast window open. Rep anyone who broadcasts "Need Armor" or "Need Shields." In low end fleets logis are few and far between. Any reps will make a difference.
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| − | * Find someone to orbit - Sometimes the best thing to do is to Orbit the primary target like everyone else, just do it at about 13-15km.
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| − | * Use your repair drones! You have to tell them to "attack" your friendly target to get them to rep.
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| − | * Use your ECM drones! Put them on the primary target or highest enemy DPS ship on grid.
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| − | * Set Combat Drones to assist another pilot. They will follow shooting commands from them and it will be one less thing to worry about.
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| − | * Laugh Really Hard when you get blown up. Its going to happen. ^.^ <br><br>
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| − | ==Logi Channel==
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| − | Once you've joined a fleet, ask for the logi channel. The logi channel is used to give information to logi pilots they may require. Not all fleets will use a logi channel. They're more common for PvP fleets that use guardians or basilisks, and for incursion fleets that have more than three logistic ships.
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| − | Hopefully the logi channel has a Logistic Coordinator that will tell all logi pilots what they need to know. Some fleets will not have a designated logi coordinator. In this case, hopefully one of the experienced logi pilots will step up to guide the rookies.
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| − | The logi channel can be used for the following information:
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| − | * Who is the logi anchor (if different than the rest of the fleet's anchor), and orbit range.
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| − | * Who should be on the watch list.
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| − | * Provide warp-ins for logi pilots that have just joined fleet, or missed warps, etc.
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| − | * How the cap chain should be set up.
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| − | * Where you should be aligned (prop mod on or off, full speed or 3/4 speed).
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| − | * Current orders. Sometimes the logis should follow different orders from the rest of the fleet.
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| − | * Catch the attention of logi pilots not doing what they should be doing. Linking their name by drag-and-drop from the channel list can help. If they still don't respond, do the same in the fleet channel and remind them to read logi chat.
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| − | The cap chain can be sorted either through the logi channel member list or through the overview. The cap chain is usually set up to be two down, or one up one down. If your corp, alliance, or coalition does not have a fixed rule for this, you should always ask in the logi channel which sorting and cap chain methods are being used.
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| − | Channels are sometimes bugged and you will appear to be in the channel but will not be able to see what anyone else types. If you don't see anyone else typing in the logi channel, ask if anyone can read what you type, then rejoin the channel if no one responds. This is sometimes a persistent bug that requires leaving and re-joining the channel several times to fix.
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| − | ==Watch List==
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| − | The FC or Logi Coordinator will sometimes tell you who you should have on your watch list. Sometimes he won't if he's too busy. If you are in a guardian or basilisk, you should have the people you should be cap transferring on your watch list at least. If you're in a small gang, you may want all the other logi pilots on your watch list.
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| − | Other ships that you may want to have on watch list: The fleet commander (both the actual FC and the person holding FC position if they aren't the same), wing commanders, the fleet booster, recon tacklers (huginn, rapier, lachesis, arazu) and sometimes T3 recon configured Proteus and Loki, some ECM ships such as scorpions.
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| − | Ask in the logi channel who you should have on your watch list. You can add people to your watch list by right clicking their name in a chat channel or the overview, and going through the menu: Fleet > Add to watch list. Or through the fleet member list in the fleet window, right click a name > add to watch list.
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| − | Fleet members taking damage will blink red in your watch list. You can instantly lock them by control-clicking their name in the watch list.
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| | ==Overview== | | ==Overview== |
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| | # Save the preset as '''9B - Blue Logi''' | | # Save the preset as '''9B - Blue Logi''' |
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| − | This '''Blue Logi''' overview preset will show all blue logistic ships on grid, not just those in your fleet. It is not possible to set up an overview preset that would only shows fleeted logi pilots. | + | This '''Blue Logi''' overview preset will show all blue logistic ships on grid, not just those in your fleet. It is not possible to set up an overview preset that would only shows fleeted logi pilots. However this only shows T2 logi, not T1. |
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| | ===Blue Caps=== | | ===Blue Caps=== |
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| | # Save the preset as '''9C - Blue Caps''' | | # Save the preset as '''9C - Blue Caps''' |
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| − | ==Cap Transfer==
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| − | The cap chain helps keep Guardians and Basilisks cap stable. Pilots with sufficient skills will generate cap in the chain, since the energy transfer modules will require less cap to activate than it will transfer to the target.
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| − | If you are in an Oneiros or Scimitar, you should not be depending on cap transfers. These ships are usually set up to be cap stable on their own at the cost of less repping power, or sometimes using cap boosters to maintain more reps for a limited amount of time.
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| − | If you are in a Guardian or Basilisk, you should be cap stable when receiving two cap transfers if you have the skill Logistics 4, and one cap transfer of you have Logistics 5. Each logi pilot should transfer cap to two other logi pilots, even if those who receive cap have logi 5. This insures redundancy in combat situations where the cap chain is often broken when ships are neuted, ECM jammed, or destroyed. Some fleets that have all logi pilots with Logistics 5 and veteran logi pilots that are good at multitasking will only transfer to one other logi pilot in the chain and will take cap requests during combat.
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| | ===Cap Direction=== | | ===Cap Direction=== |
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| | * Warrior: Warriors are the light scout drones of choice for their speed and damage type which is good against T1 armor tankers and many T2 ships that have enhanced resists. These can be especially useful against light ships, such as interdictors and various tacklers, that come withing drone control range. | | * Warrior: Warriors are the light scout drones of choice for their speed and damage type which is good against T1 armor tankers and many T2 ships that have enhanced resists. These can be especially useful against light ships, such as interdictors and various tacklers, that come withing drone control range. |
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| − | ==Lag==
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| − | During heavy lag, remote armor repair and shield transporters must be cycled manually. Do do this, each module must be set to auto-cycle off. The modules must be activated and then manually deactivated before being activated again. If auto cycle is left on, or if the modules are not forcibly deactivated, the modules will appear to cycle properly but will fail to repair beyond the first cycle.
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| − | Remote energy transfer can be left on auto cycle for the cap chain, as heavy lag is usually accompanied by infinite cap.
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| − | ==Positioning & Range Control==
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| − | [...]
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| − | ==Heavy Interdictors==
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| − | [...]
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| − | ==Capital Ships==
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| − | [...]
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| − | ==Incursion==
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| − | [...]
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| − | ==Related Links==
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| − | ===UniWiki===
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| − | * [[Logistics Ships 101]] - Class Curriculum
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| − | * [[Guide to Logistics]]
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| − | * [[Overview Guide]]
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| | ===Video=== | | ===Video=== |
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| − | * [http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1342627 Ironclad] - A Rooks and Kings video detailing logistic and triage carrier tactics. | + | * [https://youtu.be/j4hPTGN3Q6w?list=PLo1eELyNWdOXizh7sJac6z2ldzMqPwXoC Ironclad] - A Rooks and Kings video detailing logistic and triage carrier tactics. |
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| | * [http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1288092 Double Edged] - A Pandemic Legion video in two parts with logistic footage. | | * [http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1288092 Double Edged] - A Pandemic Legion video in two parts with logistic footage. |
Overview
It is important to have a blue logi overview tab set up properly, especially if you use the overview to sort the cap chain instead of the logi channel. A blue fleet tab can also be helpful.
These instructions assume you have overview presets done according to the Overview Guide. If you did not set up your overview according to the UniWiki guide, just pick an overview preset you usually use for travel and PvP to base the Blue overview presets.
Blue Fleet
- Rename one of your tabs Blue Fleet
- Load up the 2 - PvP Travel preset in that tab.
- Open Overview Settings, go to Filters > States
- Every item in the list MUST be checked EXCEPT the following four:
- Pilot (agent) is interactable
- Pilot has neutral standing
- Pilot has bad standing
- Pilot has terrible standing
- Go to Filters > Types
- Go to the Drones section, right click the Drones header and click deselect all.
- Save the preset as 9A - Blue Fleet
If you do not set up your blue overview states correctly, you might not see some blue pilots on your overview, which can be extremely problematic in many circumstances.
Blue Logi
- Rename one of your tabs Blue Logi
- Load up the 9A - Blue Fleet preset in that tab.
- Open Overview Settings, go to Filters > Types
- Go to the Ship section, right click the ship header and click deselect all.
- Open the Ship section, check the Logistics item in the list.
- Save the preset as 9B - Blue Logi
This Blue Logi overview preset will show all blue logistic ships on grid, not just those in your fleet. It is not possible to set up an overview preset that would only shows fleeted logi pilots. However this only shows T2 logi, not T1.
Blue Caps
- Rename one of your tabs Blue Caps
- Load up the 9A - Blue Fleet preset in that tab.
- Open Overview Settings, go to Filters > Types
- Go to the Ship section, right click the ship header and click deselect all.
- Open the Ship section, check the following items in the list:
- Capital Industrial Ships
- Carrier
- Dreadnought
- Jump Freighter
- Supercarrier
- Titan
- Save the preset as 9C - Blue Caps
Cap Direction
There are several ways of establishing cap transfers between logistics. The two most popular are: One Up One Down; and Two Down. Sometimes cap transfers are arranged in pairs or triples, but these tend to be less robust than full cap chains in large fleet engagements.
When using the One Up One Down method, you should transfer cap to the person above and below you in the cap chain, in alphabetical order. When using the Two Down method, you should look for the two pilots below you -- in alphabetical order -- and transfer cap to both with one cap transfer module on each. The cap chain should wrap around back to the top once it reaches the bottom of the logi channel or overview list.
You should keep an eye on your watch list and overview or logi channel member list and be ready to change cap transfer targets if necessary.
The cap chain is often broken by inattentive pilots. It is important to regularly check your distance from the anchor and other logi pilots, look for any new additions to the cap chain and for pilots leaving permanently or being disconnected temporarily, and to keep an eye on the logi channel for instructions. The cap chain is vital for the survival of the fleet. Careless pilots who cannot pay enough attention to maintain it when there is no fighting are a liability to your fleet if enemies decide to engage.
Sorting Method
The sorting method can either be done through the blue logi overview, or through the logi channel list.
If the logi channel list is used, the only people in that channel should only be currently active logi pilots on grid flying Guardians or Basilisks. And the pilots should make sure to leave channel if their ship is destroyed or if they are no longer with the rest of the fleet for any reason.
If the overview is used to order the cap chain, you should sort the Blue Logi overview by name. You should look for the two pilots that you are meant to cap according to the cap direction rule, and activate one cap transfer module on each. You must skip over Scimitars and Oneiros, you should never give cap to these ships in normal circumstances. Pay attention to ship type in the overview when setting up your cap chain list.
If you use the overview to determine sorting order, the logi channel may include non-cap transferring logi, sometimes the FC and other commanders, pilots that have had their ships destroyed, pilots that are off grid, pilots that are in another system, etc. This can help to use the logi channel to coordinate between all logi pilots and commanders.
Cap Transfer Protocol
If you are in a Guardian, you should not include Basilisks in the cap chain unless both logi types are in the same fleet and sharing the same logi channel. And Vice Versa.
The cap chain should be up and active at all times except when inside a POS shield or when the fleet is making best speed to a destination system. Even when simply aligning after jumping through a stargate, the logi pilots should establish the cap chain after uncloaking. It is best to be prepared, and to check that all cap transferring logi pilots understand who they should be transferring to.
Anchor
The Anchor is the ship you should be orbiting. You default orbit distance should be between 5 and 15 km in PvP fleets. Scimitars and Oneiros will sometimes not have an anchor and just try to keep at range from the hostiles while staying in rep range of each other and their fleetmates. In Incursion fleets, the orbit is often less than 5 km to prevent rats from orbiting too far from the damage dealers if they aggress the logi.
At 5 km orbit distance you may not have your full speed while orbiting with an AB. 10 km orbit is a common distance that will let you orbit at full speed. If your orbit distance is too far you may have a low angular velocity against the enemy fleet for a prolonged time, or you could be out of range of some broadcast requests if a fleet spreads out to chase an enemy or deblob to avoid bombing runs, or you could bump into a hostile starbase shield during a pos siege if the anchor is too close.
If you fight on a stargate, the anchor could be set as the stargate with an orbit that stays within jump range. Logi ships that take too much damage and cannot get repped fast enough can jump through if they don't have aggression.
Broadcast
You should have your Fleet window open to the broadcast history tab at all times. You can control+click items in the broadcast history to lock them.
You should keep and eye on your own shield and armor and be ready to broadcast when required. Setting up need armor and need shield shortcuts can make this easier during combat.
Click the icon at the top left of the fleet window and select broadcast settings.
- Need Armor: If you are in a shield logi, you should have this unchecked.
- Need Capacitor: If you are in a scimitar or oneiros, you should have this unchecked.
- Need Shield: If you are in an armor logi, you should have this unchecked.
- Target: You should have this unchecked unless target broadcasts are being used to focus repping on a starbase.
You should ignore all capacitor requests unless the fleet is not engaging an enemy fleet nor attacking a hot POS. If cap requests have been authorized by the FC or logi coordinator, you should switch cap transfer to one down, and use the second cap transfer module to cap up ships that have broadcast for cap. The pilots broadcasting for cap should type CF (for Cap Full) in fleet chat to indicate they no longer need cap, or use the 'in position' broadcast, depending on how the fleet usually handles this. If a pilot fails to indicate full cap after 2 to 5 cycles (this will depend on the number of cap transferring logistic ships in the fleet), you should unlock him and move on to the next broadcast in queue.
Drone Selection
Logistic ships get a bonus to drone repping, so these drones are sometimes preferred. Some battles will happen outside of drone control range, and in many fights logistic pilots will be too busy with repping to manage offensive drones separately from reps. Logistic drones will not give aggression, contrary to EW and combat drones. Aggression will prevent jumping through a stargate or docking in a station for 1 minute.
- Armor Maintenance Bot: Guardians can hold five light armor maintenance bots, Oneiros can hold five medium armor mainenance bots.
- Shield Maintenance Bot: Scimitars can hold 4 medium shield maintenance bots and 1 light shield maintenance bot. Basilisks can hold 5 light shield maintenance bots.
- ECM Drone: Hornet EC-300 drones can be handy in some circumstances. Scimitars and Oneiros with their greater drone bay may wish to keep five light maintenance bots and four or five EC-300. Other types of EW drones are often considered much less useful.
- Warrior: Warriors are the light scout drones of choice for their speed and damage type which is good against T1 armor tankers and many T2 ships that have enhanced resists. These can be especially useful against light ships, such as interdictors and various tacklers, that come withing drone control range.
Video
- Ironclad - A Rooks and Kings video detailing logistic and triage carrier tactics.
- Double Edged - A Pandemic Legion video in two parts with logistic footage.
Other
