Revision as of 16:40, 6 June 2013

Ship progression

Unless you are already heavily invested into a certain race or weapon system, it might be a good idea to think of which logistics ship, strategic cruiser or pirate faction battleship you'll want in the end, rather than what your first incursion ship should be.

You should also consider secondary value of whatever you train, perhaps you can find an end-of-the-line ship that not only furthers your goals for incursions but other goals as well given the skills you'll end up training for it. If you already know that you like smaller ships, or have plans for diving into a wormhole in the future, it would make much more sense training into a strategic cruiser than a pirate faction battleship. Depending on the race, training for strategic cruisers will make quite some progress towards being able to fly logistics as well, or the other way around if your goal is to fly logistcs. That said, most strategic cruisers pale in comparison to the pirate faction battleships who remain the epitome of incursion boats.

Races	Ship	Description
		The Machariel combines a flexible engagement range for autocannons with a high rate of fire. Fit for long range the impressive alpha is unmatched. It also has enough midslots to fit for any occasion.
		The Nightmare has very good damage at any range due to fast-swapping crystals and compensates for the innate low tracking of lasers with the ship's tracking bonus. It also has plenty of utility midslots available. Has some cap issues.
		The Vindicator is a brawler without match, both in terms of damage and incredibly strong webs. Despite appearances, it is also a very potent sniper when fitted with railguns, and tech two ammo makes it possible to use blasters at medium range.
		The Legion combines powerful short range capabilities with instant-swapping long range capabilities due to how crystals work. Ideal ship if you prefer smaller, more agile ships to the bulkier battleships.
		The Loki's combination of multiple webs and extreme tracking makes it very useful. It also has the option to fit for longer webs, which isn't always needed but makes a world of difference when it is.
		Very few Command Ships have the range and utility needed to make them good for incursions, suffering the same problems as most ships with medium weaponry. The Sleipnir stands out with exceptional tracking, range and damage capabilities.
		The Scimitar is a logistics ship, the core of fleet defense. It does not rely on energy transfers to be cap stable and can therefor be fully operational on its own. The bonus to tracking links makes it an enormous asset on the field, on top of the repairs it supplies.
		The Basilisk is another logistics ship, but unlike the Scimitar, it needs someone to exchange energy transfers with to be effective. With good skills it can provide energy transfers to the fleet or field one more shield transporter for extra repping power.

Recommended skills

The following skills are recommended, if not downright required to fit the modules you have to in order to do incursions. For more information on what the different skills do, see the Support Skills page.

The training times listed for these will assume that you trained Cybernetics I and got a cheap set of +3 attribute implants, which is not only reasonable but highly recommended regardless what you plan on doing in EVE. There's even The +3 Implants Program for unistas to get started.

Damage dealers

Getting the recommended skills for a damage dealer requires roughly 60 days at the most, if you train into a turret-based battlecruiser on a brand new character. In comparison training for missiles is longer, another week, but normally you would only take that route if you already have good missile skills to begin with and only need to top off one or two skills. If your missile skills are too low, it would be more advantageous to start training gunnery skills instead.

Considering that is far more likely that you come looking for incursions after you have played the game for at least a couple of weeks, having trained some of the support skills already (the tutorial mentions many of them), you can often get ready much faster. Add to that the potential of neural remapping and what might seem like a daunting train can be covered in no-time.

While we primarily run shield fleets, most of the skills you use will be reusable for armour fleets as well. The skills required to fit a solid armour tank is listed in the right-most column even though they are not necessary to train right away.

Support skills	Gunnery skills	Missile skills	Crosstraining armour skills
~ 40 days and 6 hours	~ 19 days and 18 hours	~ 26 days and 22 hours ^[1]	~ 12 days and 18 hours
Cybernetics I Electronics IV Engineering IV Mechanics IV Weapon Upgrades IV Energy Management IV Energy Systems Operation IV Shield Upgrades IV Tactical Shield Manipulation IV Jury Rigging III Shield Rigging III Signature Analysis IV Targeting IV Long Range Targeting IV Target Painting III ^[2] Propulsion Jamming III ^[3] Drones V Drone Interfacing III Scout Drone Operation V ^[4] Combat Drone Operation III Gallente Drone Specialization III ^[4] Drone Durability I ^[5] Repair Drone Operation II ^[5] Shield Emission Systems III ^[5] <racial> Frigate IV <racial> Cruiser III <racial> Battlecruiser IV Spaceship Command IV	Gunnery IV Small <racial> Turret III Medium <racial> Turret IV Motion Prediction IV Rapid Firing IV Sharpshooter IV Surgical Strike IV Trajectory Analysis IV Controlled Bursts IV ^[6] <weapon> Rigging III ^[7]	Missile Launcher Operation V ^[8] Light Missiles III Heavy Missiles IV Missile Projection IV Missile Bombardment IV Rapid Launch IV Guided Missile Precision IV Target Navigation Prediction IV Warhead upgrades IV Launcher Rigging III	Hull Upgrades V Armor Rigging III EM Armor Compensation III Explosive Armor Compensation III Kinetic Armor Compensation III Thermic Armor Compensation III Repair Systems II ^[9] Remote Armor Repair Systems III ^[10]
^ This is more of a checklist if you wish to bring a missile boat into Incursions. As mentioned before, you shouldn't train these skills if you don't have them. ^ Target Painting III is only needed if you'll use a Target Painter module. ^ Propulsion Jamming III is only needed if you'll use a Stasis Webifier module. ^ ^a ^b Drones V, Scout Drone Operation V and Gallente Drone Specialization I is required to use Hobgoblin II drones. ^ ^a ^b ^c Drone Durability I, Repair Drone Operation II and Shield Emission System III is required to use Light and Medium Shield Maintenance drones, which can be trained in mere hours if you can already use tech two scout drones. ^ Controlled Bursts is useful for all hybrids and lasers, but useless for projectiles and missiles as they do not utilize cap. ^ If your first ship doesn't have an offensive weapon rig, then you can skip this skill initially and just train it later on. ^ It's necessary to train Missile Launcher Operation V in order to be able to train Guided Missile Precision, which is essential to apply damage to small frigates. ^ Mechanics III and Repair Systems II are required to train Remote Armor Repair Systems. ^ Remote Armor Repair Systems III is required to use Light and Medium Armor Maintenance drones.

With the above mentioned skills, young unistas interested in doing incursions can fly one of the Minimum Incursion fits, while they train for a more suitable ship. See moving into useful hulls below for further training.

Logistics

Training for logistics is considerably more time-consuming than that of a regular damage dealer. Please remember that when you think the above mentioned skills for a damage dealer is a long train.

It takes up to 80 days to get good enough skills to fly a logistics starter fit.

Support skills	Shield skills	Drone skills	Crosstraining into armour
~ 66 days and 21 hours	~ 7 days and 19 hours	~ 5 days and 6 hours	~ 41 days and 12 hours
Cybernetics I Electronics IV Engineering IV Mechanics IV Energy Management IV Energy Systems Operation IV Energy Grid Upgrades IV Jury Rigging III Targeting V ^[1] Multitasking III ^[2] <racial> Frigate IV <racial> Cruiser V Long Range Targeting V ^[3] Signature Analysis V ^[3] Logistics IV Energy Emission Systems IV ^[4] Sensor Linking IV ^[5]	Tactical Shield Manipulation IV Shield Upgrades IV Shield Rigging III Shield Emission Systems IV	Drones V Drone Durability I Repair Drone Operation II	Hull Upgrades V Repair Systems II Armor Rigging III Remote Repair Systems IV EM Armor Compensation III Explosive Armor Compensation III Kinetic Armor Compensation III Thermic Armor Compensation III <racial> Frigate IV <racial Cruiser V
^ Targeting V is needed to train Multitasking. ^ Multitasking trained to III is needed to be able to lock up to ten targets at once. ^ ^a ^b Long Range Targeting V and Signature Analysis V are prerequisites for Logistics. ^ Energy Emission Systems is only required for a Guardian/Basilisk with energy transfer modules, the Oneiros/Scimitar does not need this skill. ^ Sensor Linking is only required if you can fit the Tracking Link module.

Thermodynamics

While not critical, being able to overheat your modules for a short while is often more than enough to save your ship when things turn from bad to worse. As such, it's also recommended that people train the following skills:

Engineering V (+4 days and 6 hours)
Science IV (+18 hours)
Thermodynamics III (+11,5 hours)

Moving into useful hulls

Once you have the recommended skills, the step from a Battlecruiser up to a decent Battleship is surprisingly short and you should take this step as soon as possible to get into a decent ship. You might need to top off some of the support skills, pending on what ship you decide to move into, if you run into powergrid, CPU or cap issues.

If the Wartime Standard Operating Procedures (WSOP) is not an issue, there's also the strategic cruisers and the pirate faction battleships. For strategic cruisers you'll most likely continue with the gunnery skills you have but will require some support skills to V and of course your racial cruiser of choice to V. Then you just move towards tech two medium weapons for further efficiency. For pirate faction battleships hulls like the Machariel, Nightmare and Vindicator, which are better in all regards compared to the regular battleships regardless of your skill, you only need to train a secondary racial ship-line.

Flying ships that cost over a billion in just the hull shouldn't be taken lightly however, but from an efficiency point of view there is no reason not to get one.

Battleships	Strategic Cruisers	Pirate Faction Battleships	Crosstraining into a new race
~ 10 days and 2 hours	~ 40 days and 4 hours	~ 17 days and 16 hours	~ 13 days and 8 hours
<racial> Battleship III Gunnery V Large <weapon> Turret III	Mechanics V Shield Operation III Electronics V Engineering V Gunnery V ^[1] Missile Launcher Operation V ^[2] Navigation V <racial> Cruiser V	<primary> Cruiser IV <primary> Battleship III <secondary> Frigate IV <secondary> Cruiser IV <secondary> Battleship III Gunnery V Large <weapon> Turret III	<racial> Frigate IV <racial> Cruiser IV <racial> Battleship III Gunnery V ^[3] Small <weapon> Turret III Medium <weapon> Turret III Large <weapon> Turret III
^ Gunnery V for the Legion, Loki and Proteus, but only Gunnery III for the Tengu. ^ Missile Launcher Operation V for the Tengu and Missile Launcher Operation III for the Loki. Neither the Legion or the Proteus needs this skill trained unless they decide to fit missiles. ^ Gunnery V alone takes 4 days and 6 hours to train. If you have it already, or if you're crosstraining into another racial battlecruiser, the time to crosstrain is significantly shorter.

See the recommended battleship fits for vanguards and assaults.

This is just the the beginning ...

Remember that these recommendations are just for the basic levels and there is much room for improvement. Increase these skills, train up for tech two weaponry and max out the gunnery and support skills, and your ship will be much more efficient. You'll also have many more options to improve your fit with better fitting and support skills, like upgrading a module, swap out an ancillary current rig for a damage rig, drop an excessive tank module for more utility modules and so forth.

What you're going to train next differs a little bit based on what ship and what weapons you're going to use. For some fitting skills will be prioritized due to the lack of CPU/powergrid of their hull, for others capacitor skills are more important while others can simply go straight for better ship skills and tech two weaponry.

Fitting skills	Support skills	Gunnery skills	Logistics skills
Prioritize which skills to train first, some are more important than others, so do your research.
Cybernetics V ^[1] Electronics V Engineering V Mechanics V	Jury Rigging IV ^[2] Energy Management V Energy Systems Operation V Shield Upgrades V Tactical Shield Manipulation V Shield Rigging IV Targeting V Multitasking III Long Range Targeting V Electronic Warfare IV ^[3] Electronic Warfare Drone Interfacing IV^[4] Drone Interfacing V	Weapon Upgrades V Advanced Weapon Upgrades V Gunnery V Motion Prediction V Rapid Firing V Sharpshooter V Surgical Strike V Trajectory Analysis V Controlled Bursts V ^[5] <weapon> Rigging IV Small <racial> Turret V Medium <racial> Turret V Large <racial> Turret V Small <racial> Specialization IV ^[6] Medium <racial> Specialization IV ^[6] Large <racial> Specialization IV ^[6] <racial> Battleship V	Shield Emission Systems V Energy Emission Systems V ^[7] Sensor Linking V ^[8] Repair Drone operation V ^[9]
^ Cybernetics V is required for the top-tier advanced implants, like the +6% CONCORD-implants. ^ Jury Rigging IV is only needed if it is a requirement for your more generic rigs, like energy grid rigs. ^ Electronic Warfare is required for Electronic Warfare Drone Interfacing. ^ Electronic Warfare Drone Interfacing increases your drone control range by an additional 3 km / skillevel. ^ Controlled Bursts is useful for all hybrids and lasers, but useless for projectiles and missiles as they do not utilize cap. ^ ^a ^b ^c Turrets have two different specialization skills, for example projectiles have both autocannons and artillery which are split into two different specialization skills. ^ Energy Emission Systems is only required if you fly a Guardian or a Basilisk with energy transfer modules, the Oneiros and the Scimitar does not need this skill. ^ Sensor Linking is only required if you can fit the Tracking Link module and only needed at higher skill-levels if you try to fit several faction links at once. ^ Repair Drone Operation V is needed for tech two shield maintenance bots.

Once you've trained these skills, you can fly some of the more advanced fits for vanguards or assaults.

[1] This is more of a checklist if you wish to bring a missile boat into Incursions. As mentioned before, you shouldn't train these skills if you don't have them.

[2] Target Painting III is only needed if you'll use a Target Painter module.

[3] Propulsion Jamming III is only needed if you'll use a Stasis Webifier module.

[hobgoblins-4] Drones V, Scout Drone Operation V and Gallente Drone Specialization I is required to use Hobgoblin II drones.

[maintenance-5] Drone Durability I, Repair Drone Operation II and Shield Emission System III is required to use Light and Medium Shield Maintenance drones, which can be trained in mere hours if you can already use tech two scout drones.

[6] Controlled Bursts is useful for all hybrids and lasers, but useless for projectiles and missiles as they do not utilize cap.

[7] If your first ship doesn't have an offensive weapon rig, then you can skip this skill initially and just train it later on.

[8] It's necessary to train Missile Launcher Operation V in order to be able to train Guided Missile Precision, which is essential to apply damage to small frigates.

[9] Mechanics III and Repair Systems II are required to train Remote Armor Repair Systems.

[10] Remote Armor Repair Systems III is required to use Light and Medium Armor Maintenance drones.

[11] Targeting V is needed to train Multitasking.

[12] Multitasking trained to III is needed to be able to lock up to ten targets at once.

[logi-13] Long Range Targeting V and Signature Analysis V are prerequisites for Logistics.

[emission-14] Energy Emission Systems is only required for a Guardian/Basilisk with energy transfer modules, the Oneiros/Scimitar does not need this skill.

[links-15] Sensor Linking is only required if you can fit the Tracking Link module.

[16] Gunnery V for the Legion, Loki and Proteus, but only Gunnery III for the Tengu.

[17] Missile Launcher Operation V for the Tengu and Missile Launcher Operation III for the Loki. Neither the Legion or the Proteus needs this skill trained unless they decide to fit missiles.

[18] Gunnery V alone takes 4 days and 6 hours to train. If you have it already, or if you're crosstraining into another racial battlecruiser, the time to crosstrain is significantly shorter.

[19] Cybernetics V is required for the top-tier advanced implants, like the +6% CONCORD-implants.

[20] Jury Rigging IV is only needed if it is a requirement for your more generic rigs, like energy grid rigs.

[21] Electronic Warfare is required for Electronic Warfare Drone Interfacing.

[22] Electronic Warfare Drone Interfacing increases your drone control range by an additional 3 km / skillevel.

[23] Controlled Bursts is useful for all hybrids and lasers, but useless for projectiles and missiles as they do not utilize cap.

[specs-24] Turrets have two different specialization skills, for example projectiles have both autocannons and artillery which are split into two different specialization skills.

[emission-25] Energy Emission Systems is only required if you fly a Guardian or a Basilisk with energy transfer modules, the Oneiros and the Scimitar does not need this skill.

[links-26] Sensor Linking is only required if you can fit the Tracking Link module and only needed at higher skill-levels if you try to fit several faction links at once.

[27] Repair Drone Operation V is needed for tech two shield maintenance bots.

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@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 {{incursions links}}
+= Ship progression =
+Unless you are already heavily invested into a certain race or weapon system, it might be a good idea to think of which logistics ship, strategic cruiser or pirate faction battleship you'll want in the end, rather than what your first incursion ship should be.
+You should also consider secondary value of whatever you train, perhaps you can find an end-of-the-line ship that not only furthers your goals for incursions but other goals as well given the skills you'll end up training for it. If you already know that you like smaller ships, or have plans for diving into a wormhole in the future, it would make much more sense training into a strategic cruiser than a pirate faction battleship. Depending on the race, training for strategic cruisers will make quite some progress towards being able to fly logistics as well, or the other way around if your goal is to fly logistcs. That said, most strategic cruisers pale in comparison to the pirate faction battleships who remain the epitome of incursion boats.
+{| class="wikitable" style="text-align:left; font-size:90%; border-collapse:collapse; border:1px solid #333333; padding:5px;"
+|-
+! style="background:#222222;" | Races
+! style="background:#222222;" | Ship
+! style="background:#222222;" | Description
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:logo_faction_minmatar_republic.png|64px]][[image:logo_faction_gallente_federation.png|64px]]
+| style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Machariel.jpg|64px]]
+| The [[Machariel]] combines a flexible engagement range for autocannons with a high rate of fire. Fit for long range the impressive alpha is unmatched. It also has enough midslots to fit for any occasion.
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:logo_faction_amarr_empire.png|64px]][[image:logo_faction_caldari_state.png|64px]]
+| style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Nightmare.jpg|64px]]
+| The [[Nightmare]] has very good damage at any range due to fast-swapping crystals and compensates for the innate low tracking of lasers with the ship's tracking bonus. It also has plenty of utility midslots available. Has some cap issues.
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:logo_faction_gallente_federation.png|64px]][[image:logo_faction_minmatar_republic.png|64px]]
+| style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Vindicator.jpg|64px]]
+| The [[Vindicator]] is a brawler without match, both in terms of damage and incredibly strong webs. Despite appearances, it is also a very potent sniper when fitted with railguns, and tech two ammo makes it possible to use blasters at medium range.
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px; text-align:center;" | [[image:logo_faction_amarr_empire.png|64px]]
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Legion.jpg|64px]]
+| The [[Legion]] combines powerful short range capabilities with instant-swapping long range capabilities due to how crystals work. Ideal ship if you prefer smaller, more agile ships to the bulkier battleships.
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px; text-align:center;" | [[image:logo_faction_minmatar_republic.png|64px]]
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Loki.jpg|64px]]
+| The [[Loki]]'s combination of multiple webs and extreme tracking makes it very useful. It also has the option to fit for longer webs, which isn't always needed but makes a world of difference when it is.
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:logo_faction_minmatar_republic.png|64px]][[image:logo_boundless_creation.png|64px]]
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Sleipnir.jpg|64px]]
+| Very few Command Ships have the range and utility needed to make them good for incursions, suffering the same problems as most ships with medium weaponry. The [[Sleipnir]] stands out with exceptional tracking, range and damage capabilities.
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:logo_faction_minmatar_republic.png|64px]][[image:logo_core_complexion_inc.png|64px]]
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Scimitar.jpg|64px]]
+| The [[Scimitar]] is a logistics ship, the core of fleet defense. It does not rely on energy transfers to be cap stable and can therefor be fully operational on its own. The bonus to tracking links makes it an enormous asset on the field, on top of the repairs it supplies.
+|- valign="top"
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:logo_faction_caldari_state.png|64px]][[image:logo_lai_dai.png|64px]]
+| nowrap style="padding:0px;" | [[image:Basilisk.jpg|64px]]
+| The [[Basilisk]] is another logistics ship, but unlike the Scimitar, it needs someone to exchange energy transfers with to be effective. With good skills it can provide energy transfers to the fleet or field one more shield transporter for extra repping power.
+|}
 = Recommended skills =
 The following skills are recommended, if not downright required to fit the modules you have to in order to do incursions. For more information on what the different skills do, see the [[Support_Skills#Skills|Support Skills]] page.
@@ Line 5: / Line 48: @@
 The training times listed for these will assume that you trained '''Cybernetics I''' and got a cheap set of '''+3 attribute implants''', which is not only reasonable but highly recommended regardless what you plan on doing in EVE. There's even [[The +3 Implants Program]] for unistas to get started.
-It's worth thinking one step further and try to figure out which of the advanced hulls you think you'll likely train into, then pick the most suitable path there in terms of which racial ship-line you go down first and what weapon system you train into. For example, if you do not meet the recommended skills for missiles it might be a good idea to consider how much time it would take to cross-train into a turret-based ship right away instead of spending precious time continuing to train missile skills. There's no point trying to pick the ''"best"'' Battlecruiser, simply because they all have downsides making them less than ideal for incursioning.
-That said, it's perfectly fine to top off your current skills to meet the minimum requirement to come try incursions, if you're not sure you'll like it. You don't have to commit before trying it out.
-<small><references/></small>
 == Damage dealers ==
 Getting the recommended skills for a damage dealer requires roughly 60 days at the most, if you train into a turret-based battlecruiser on a brand new character. In comparison training for missiles is longer, another week, but normally you would only take that route if you already have good missile skills to begin with and only need to top off one or two skills. If your missile skills are too low, it would be more advantageous to start training gunnery skills instead.
@@ Line 156: / Line 195: @@
 * '''Science IV''' ''(+18 hours)''
 * '''Thermodynamics III''' ''(+11,5 hours)''
 = Moving into useful hulls =
 Once you have the recommended skills, the step from a Battlecruiser up to a decent Battleship is surprisingly short and you should take this step as soon as possible to get into a decent ship. You might need to top off some of the support skills, pending on what ship you decide to move into, if you run into powergrid, CPU or cap issues.

Difference between revisions of "Preparing for Incursions"

Revision as of 16:40, 6 June 2013

Contents

Ship progression

Recommended skills

Damage dealers

Logistics

Thermodynamics

Moving into useful hulls

This is just the the beginning ...

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