User:Olly Wakwako/sandbox/Incursion Upgrades and Progression

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Overview

The EVE University Incursion Community doesn't require unistas to use fancy hulls and modules or put expensive implants into your head. If you wish, you may use our loaner battleships indefinitely. However, we encourage those that enjoy the content and have the means to upgrade their ships, as it opens the possibility to take part in other communities, and allows us to run Vanguards more effectively

There are a lot of ways to spend ISK on your incursion character in order to improve your performance, be that buying a pirate faction battleship, getting faction and deadspace modules or injecting implants into your head. Some of these options are more effective than others, so before you start "throwing ISK at the problem" with wild abandon ... take a moment to consider your options.

In general we suggest making upgrades following this rough order, designed to prioritize upgrades which reuiqre less time and isk investment and which provide the largest benefit:

  • We suggest that unistas use the loaner battleships provided by the Incursions Community until you can afford to buy a Pirate Faction Battleship. At that point, you should buy yourself the full starter fit for your preferred hull.
  • You should at this point train towards the appropriate Tier II weapon system for the hull you have chosen.
  • Following this, as you gain isk, you should replace modules, slowly upgrading from Tier II to faction or deadspace.
  • You could also consider at this point training Cypernetics V and buying a WS-618 warp speed implant.
  • Once you have fully upgraded your Pirate Battleship, you should consider training into the Marauder which shares a weapon system with your current ship (Vargur from Macheriel, Kronos from Vindicator, Paladin from Nightmare).
  • Following buying and fitting a Marauder, you should finish by completing your implant set following the Implants Guide.

Ship progression

Progression varies a little between the roles of logistics and damage dealers, but is somewhat straight forward with easily identified high-end ships to aim for.

Logistics

The Oneiros is the optimal logistics ship for Vanguard sites. There is little in terms of hull progression in this regard - the best progression opportunity is skill-based, and comes in the training of Logistics Cruisers V, which affords a significant improvement in capacitor stability as compared to Logistics Cruisers IV.

Despite this, there are other ships that are more than capable of providing the logistics we require in our fleets. Of these, the most notable is the Nestor, which is commonly seen in Headquarters sites owing to its overwhelming remote repair power. The Nestor is significantly more expensive compared to the Oneiros, and the benefits it provides to those running Headquarters sites are not so relevant in Vanguard sites.

Oneiros

Icon tech2.png
Logo faction minmatar republic.png
Oneiros.jpg
The Oneiros
Oneiros.jpg
CornerT2s.png
Oneiros
Logistics Cruisers Exequror Class
Icon hi slot.png4 (0/2) Icon mid slot.png4 Icon low slot.png5
Icon powergrid.png1,050 MW Icon cpu.png370 tf
Icon velocity.png230 m/sec
Icon capacity.png600 m³
is cap stable on its own and does not require a cap chain to run all its remote armour repairers. That and the bonus to remote tracking computers means it's favoured in any fleet.

Logo faction gallente federation clean.pngGallente Cruiser
Icon remote armor repair i.pngRemote Armor Repair Systems
Icon tracking computer i.pngSensor Linking (favoured in vanguard sites for their remote tracking computer bonus)

Nestor

Icon tech2.png
Logo faction caldari state.png
Nestor.jpg
The Nestor
Nestor.jpg
CornerTFs.png
Nestor
Pirate Faction Battleships Nestor Class
Icon highlights.png5,000 m³ Ship Maintenance Bay
Icon hi slot.png7 (0/5) Icon mid slot.png6 Icon low slot.png6
Icon powergrid.png11,250 MW Icon cpu.png680 tf
Icon velocity.png70 m/sec
Icon capacity.png875 m³
is an extremely versatile ship, that is capable of not only self-tanking a Vanguard site, but also dishing out an overwhelming amount of remote repairs. The Nestor does not represent a progression from the Oneiros for a fleet running Vanguard sites (particularly as it does not have a bonus to remote tracking computers), but having one opens the door to trying out logistics in a Headquarters fleet.

Logo faction amarr empire clean.pngAmarr Battleship
Logo faction gallente federation clean.pngGallente Battleship
Icon drones.pngThe Nestor is bonused for drone hitpoints and damage.

Pirate faction battleships

The Nightmare and Vindicator are the preferred intermediate hullsfor incursions due to a combination of higher base stats, better bonuses and better slot layouts as compared to T1 battleships and the Praxis. The Machariel is also acceptable, but armour Machariels struggle with a lack of lowslots, and are not accepted in headquarters fleets.

Some of these have a natural progression, like the Maelstrom pilot only needing Gallente Battleship to move into a Machariel and a Hyperion pilot only needing to train Minmatar Battleship to get into the Vindicator. Left a bit on the side is the Rokh with a low priority synergy with the Nightmare given the Caldari Battleship skill and a slightly stronger synergy with the Vindicator given that they both use the Large Hybrid Turret skill for their guns.

Training up a racial battleship skill from scratch to III takes less than four days and training a new racial turret skill to III is about a day and a half, so even if some of these ships have natural progression; don't feel like you're a slave to your initial choice of ship or weaponry.


Nightmare

Icon faction.png
Logo faction sanshas nation.png
Nightmare.jpg
The Nightmare
Nightmare.jpg
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Nightmare
Pirate Faction Battleships Nightmare Class
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of Medium Slots
Icon hi slot.png6 (0/4) Icon mid slot.png7 Icon low slot.png6
Icon powergrid.png14,500 MW Icon cpu.png710 tf
Icon velocity.png114 m/sec
Icon capacity.png830 m³
has very good damage at any range due to fast-swapping crystals and compensates for the innate low tracking of lasers with the ship's tracking bonus. It also has plenty of utility midslots available. Has some cap issues putting some pressure on good cap skills.

Logo faction amarr empire clean.pngAmarr Battleship (increases turret tracking speed)
Logo faction caldari state clean.pngCaldari Battleship (low priority as the afterburner effect is never used)
Icon turret pulse large.pngLarge Energy Turret


Vindicator

Icon faction.png
Logo faction serpentis.png
Vindicator.jpg
The Vindicator
Vindicator.jpg
CornerTFs.png
Vindicator
Pirate Faction Battleships Megathron Class
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of High Slots
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of Low Slots
Icon hi slot.png8 (0/8) Icon mid slot.png5 Icon low slot.png7
Icon powergrid.png17,500 MW Icon cpu.png630 tf
Icon velocity.png132 m/sec
Icon capacity.png850 m³
is a brawler without match, both in terms of damage and incredibly strong webs. Despite appearances, it can also apply at range with Null ammunition once upgraded with Tech II blasters.

Logo faction gallente federation clean.pngGallente Battleship [1] (increases turret tracking speed)
Logo faction minmatar republic clean.pngMinmatar Battleship [1] (highest priority as it increases webifier effectiveness)
Icon turret blaster large.pngLarge Hybrid Turret


Machariel

The Macheriel struggles a little bit as an armour ship. With its resists and lack of low slots, it can only fit two damage modules. You should only choose this ship if you already have one, or if you desparately want to progress into the Vargur and don't want to cross-train into a different ship (the Vinidcator has shared Battleship skills so might be a good choice instead).
Icon faction.png
Logo faction angel cartel.png
Machariel.jpg
The Machariel
Machariel.jpg
CornerTFs.png
Machariel
Pirate Faction Battleships Machariel Class
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of High Slots
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of Low Slots
Icon hi slot.png8 (0/7) Icon mid slot.png6 Icon low slot.png6
Icon powergrid.png17,950 MW Icon cpu.png600 tf
Icon velocity.png161 m/sec
Icon capacity.png860 m³
combines a flexible engagement range for autocannons with a high rate of fire. Fit for long range the impressive alpha is unmatched, although it does suffer comparably with lower overall dps. It also has enough midslots to fit for any occasion.

Logo faction gallente federation clean.pngGallente Battleship [1] (increases turret falloff)
Logo faction minmatar republic clean.pngMinmatar Battleship [1] (highest priority increases turret damage)
Icon turret autocannon large.pngLarge Projectile Turret

  1. ^ a b c d Gallente Battleship and Minmatar Battleship are shared between both the Machariel and the Vindicator, so if you like flying multiple hulls you'd have the ship skills covered and you'd only need to train a new racial turret skill.

In almost all cases, upgrading your hull should be your first goal if you're looking to invest more ISK. Generally speaking for hisec, while faction and deadspace modules are great, pirate faction hulls often give superior bonuses without inflating the value of droppable modules fit to your ship. In the case of Incursions specifically, the matter comes down to the pirate faction battleships having two damage bonuses and powerful role bonuses (instead of having an offensive and a defensive bonus), plus much better overall ship stats such as align time.

Below is a list of some of the differences (relevant to incursions) for a Vindicator compared to a Megathron, a Machariel compared to a Tempest, and a Nightmare compared to a Apocalypse.

Improvements Hyperion » Vindicator Maelstrom » Machariel Praxis » Nightmare
Icon gunnery turret.png Effective turrets [1] +22,2% more damage +9,4% more damage +33,3% more damage
Icon tracking.png Tracking speed +37,5% more tracking Similar +37,5% more tracking
Icon target range.png Turret falloff Similar +50% more falloff Similar
Icon capacitor capacity.png Capacitor recharge [2] +14,3% capacitor recharge +4,7% capacitor recharge +17,8% capacitor recharge
Icon shield.png Shield hit points +16,7% more shield hp +16,5% more shield hp +62,3% more shield hp
Icon ship sig.png Signature 17,5% smaller signature 23,9% smaller signature 20,4% smaller signature
Icon target range.png Targeting range 20,8% longer lock range Similar 37,1% longer lock range
Icon drones.png Drone capacity -50 m3 drone bay +25 m3 drone bay -150 m3 drone bay
Icon sensor resolution.png Scan resolution -9,1% scan resolution +38,9% scan resolution -15,2% scan resolution
Icon warp speed.png Warp speed Same +1 AU/s warp speed Same
Icon inertia.png Inertia +29,7% more agile +29,4% more agile -18,0% less agile
Icon velocity.png Velocity[3] +14,7% faster +71,3% faster +52,0% faster
  1. ^ Effective turrets is a measure of raw turrets modified by rate of fire or damage bonuses of the hulls as well as role bonuses.
  2. ^ Peak recharge is a measure of capacitor capacity / capacitor recharge time * 2,5 (peak coefficient). See capacitor recharge rate for more information.
  3. ^ A ship's velocity is unimportant in Vanguards, but valued in Assaults and Headquarters, which involve moving with microwarpdrives to anchor positions.

Marauders

These ships are the apex of Incursions. Owing to their ability to equip the Bastion Module I, they possess a tremendous amount of stopping power. It is not unheard of to have Paladins doing over 3000 DPS, and Kronoses doing over 4000 DPS. Not only this, but they are able to tank the incoming DPS of any site alone (though not always indefinitely). Each of the pirate hulls naturally leads to one of the Marauders - the Nightmare to the Paladin, the Machariel to the Vargur, and the Vindicator to the Kronos.

Paladin

Icon faction.png
Logo faction amarr empire.png
Paladin.jpg
The Paladin
Paladin.jpg
CornerT2s.png
Paladin
Marauders Apocalypse Class
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of High Slots
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of Low Slots
Icon hi slot.png8 (0/4) Icon mid slot.png4 Icon low slot.png7
Icon powergrid.png16,000 MW Icon cpu.png530 tf
Icon velocity.png100 m/sec
Icon capacity.png1,125 m³
is the king of projection - it can apply over 2000 DPS at ranges of 70km or more without breaking a sweat. To pay for this, it suffers slightly from a lack of midslots, hampering it's versatility, and aenemic tracking, and somewhat poor capacitor life.

Logo faction amarr empire clean.pngAmarr Battleship Improves capacitor and range projection
Icon bastion.pngMarauders Increases damage and tank
Icon turret pulse large.pngLarge Energy Turret Increases damage

Kronos

Icon faction.png
Logo faction gallente federation.png
Kronos.jpg
The Kronos
Kronos.jpg
CornerT2s.png
Kronos
Marauders Megathron Class
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of High Slots
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of Low Slots
Icon hi slot.png7 (0/4) Icon mid slot.png5 Icon low slot.png7
Icon powergrid.png14,000 MW Icon cpu.png580 tf
Icon velocity.png105 m/sec
Icon capacity.png1,275 m³
is the poster child of raw damage - within 30km it can dump out 4000 DPS with sufficient tracking to apply to frigates as well as cruisers. It suffers from a lack of projection to be sure, but with a few extra midslots it can fit extra tracking computers to compensate somewhat.

Logo faction gallente federation clean.pngGallente Battleship Improves damage and range
Icon bastion.pngMarauders Increases tank and tracking speed
Icon turret blaster large.pngLarge Hybrid Turret Increases damage


Vargur

Icon faction.png
Logo faction gallente federation.png
Vargur.jpg
The Kronos
Kronos.jpg
CornerT2s.png
Kronos
Marauders Megathron Class
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of High Slots
Icon highlights.pngHigh Amount of Low Slots
Icon hi slot.png7 (0/4) Icon mid slot.png5 Icon low slot.png7
Icon powergrid.png14,000 MW Icon cpu.png580 tf
Icon velocity.png105 m/sec
Icon capacity.png1,275 m³
is the poster child of raw damage - within 30km it can dump out 4000 DPS with sufficient tracking to apply to frigates as well as cruisers. It suffers from a lack of projection to be sure, but with a few extra midslots it can fit extra tracking computers to compensate somewhat.

Logo faction gallente federation clean.pngGallente Battleship Improves damage and range
Icon bastion.pngMarauders Increases tank and tracking speed
Icon turret blaster large.pngLarge Hybrid Turret Increases damage

Fit Progression

For the most part, fit progression is really only relevant for high-end ships like the three pirate faction battleships mentioned above. Logistics ships use pretty much the same rigs, changing only a few modules based on their desired fit. Remember that upgrading from a regular battleship to a pirate faction battleship alone is a big upgrade and the best use of your ISK for the initial upgrade.

See upgrade priorities for more information and remember that your options are highly limited by your choice of rigs. That choice also heavily influences the amount of ISK you need to front to make the fit work. The examples below will use the more common setups, so will not include specialized fits such as the warp speed variant.

Cheap

If you're not entirely sure how you want to fit your ship in the end, the same principle that we follow to fit our minimum fits can be applied to pirate faction ships as well. Practically you can fit a Vindicator more or less the same way you'd fit a Hyperion. The same goes for fitting a Machariel similar to how you fit a Maelstrom.

Here's an example of a Nightmare fit according to our principles, with only a minor change to rigs since their increased stats make shield extender rigs superfluous.

Nightmare: Cheap setup (example)
EFT
[Nightmare, Cheap setup (example)]

Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
EM Shield Hardener II

Damage Control II

Large Thermal Shield Reinforcer I
Large Energy Burst Aerator II



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FITTING DIFFICULTY
EVE VERSION
June 2020
ALPHA CAN USE
UNSET
EFT
SKILLS
NOTES
RECOMMENDED SKILLS
NOTES
  • The Nightmare is often the only decent entry-ship for Amarr pilots.
  • Even using the standard setup the ship sports plenty of midslots allowing for a high number of utility modules, four to be exact.


Effective

... will free up an extra midslot.

If you want to keep the cost of the fit down while still having some improvements, you could go halfway with the cheapest deadspace modules. The advanced EM rig setup from the fitting principles page will free up an extra midslot.

Icon information square.png Note: This fit changes the rig to a Icon resist em.pngLarge EM Shield Reinforcer I and will not work with other resist rigs.

Machariel: Effective setup (example)
EFT
[Machariel, Effective setup (example)]

Pithum C-Type Multispectrum Shield Hardener
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II

Damage Control II

Large EM Shield Reinforcer I
Large Projectile Burst Aerator II



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icon?size=64&.png
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FITTING DIFFICULTY
EVE VERSION
April 2020
ALPHA CAN USE
UNSET
EFT
SKILLS
NOTES
RECOMMENDED SKILLS
NOTES
  • With a cheap setup you'd use up 3 midslots for tank, this only uses two, giving you one extra midslot for utility modules.
  • Increasing the tank for this fit is a bit limited, but you can either add a normal Multispectrum Shield Hardener II module for assaults, or if you want to solidify your tank for headquarters, two Pithum B-Type Multispectrum Shield Hardeners.


Optimal

... gives you maximum damage and will free up two extra midslots.

If you're willing to spend a little bit more on your favourite cash-cow ship, you can take it one step further with one of the more costly deadspace hardeners. The advanced electromagnetic rig setup from the fitting principles page gives you maximum damage and will free up an extra midslot.

Here's an example of a Vindicator fit according to that principle.

Icon information square.png Note: This fit changes the rig to a Icon resist em.pngLarge EM Shield Reinforcer I and will not work with other resist rigs.

Vindicator: Optimal setup (example)
EFT
[Vindicator, Optimal setup (example)]

Pithum B-Type Multispectrum Shield Hardener

Damage Control II

Large EM Shield Reinforcer I
Large Hybrid Burst Aerator II



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FITTING DIFFICULTY
EVE VERSION
June 2020
ALPHA CAN USE
UNSET
EFT
SKILLS
NOTES
RECOMMENDED SKILLS
NOTES
  • With a cheap setup you'd use up 3 midslots for tank, leaving only 2 midslots for utility modules. But since you're only using 1 midslot you now have room for two additional midslots.
  • Increasing the tank for this fit can be as cheap as adding a normal Multispectrum Shield Hardener II module for assaults, or if you want to solidify your tank for headquarters, a second Pithum B-Type or Pithum A-Type Multispectrum Shield Hardener.


Faction and deadspace modules

First of all, remember that getting a pirate faction hull is always going to give you better applied damage (and often many other advantages) compared to spending ISK on faction and deadspace modules. With the exception of the Federation Navy or Serpentis Stasis Webifier and tech two weapons, it is recommended that you get a better hull long before you look into upgrading modules.

Consider the actual benefit you will get from upgrading a certain module. Getting a deadspace hardener is useful for most ships as it frees up a midslot. But even though a faction tracking computer or a sensor booster might make sense for public fleets built to compete, for our community that isn't going to be as worthwhile of an investment as we usually don't compete.

What do you get in return?

To put this into perspective you need to factor in stacking penalties. If you're just using one module to a given effect, it's easy to calculate and see the difference, but when you have more intricate combinations where things end up 2nd, 3rd, 4th or 5th in the stacking hierarchy, it might be a little harder to see what you get out of it.

Module variants and price deviations

Market.png When you're shopping for faction or deadspace modules, check all equivalent variants for price deviations. For example, the Federation Navy Tracking Computer is identical in all but the name to the Shadow Serpentis Tracking Computer and their prices fluctuate over time, so use the Show Info and Compare-feature ingame to find potential alternatives and you might save millions.


Injecting implants

There are plenty of hardwiring implants that are useful for incursion runners, with effects ranging from damage projection (tracking, damage or rate of fire) to fitting/support related effects (increased capacitor, powergrid or CPU) and warp speed. The bonuses from implants do not suffer stacking penalties, thus even the +3% variants are quite potent and cheap enough to use even while at war due to the low risk of actually losing your pod.

The best hardwiring implants (apart from officer implants) come from the CONCORD Loyalty Point store and give a +6% bonus but require Cybernetics V. Implants are available for all skills and wallets however, ranging from the 1%, 3% and 5% implants of normal LP stores to the CONCORD specific 2%, 4% and 6% implants.

As with all things, do your research and see if it's cheaper to simply buy it off of the market instead of getting it yourself from the LP store. See hardwiring implants for a full list of available implants.

See the Incursion Community Implant Guide for more information about recommended implants. This guide will cover the two types of implants that we suggest: Skill Hardwiring (slots 6-10) and Attribute Enhancing (slots 1-5). These implants are not required to fly in our community, but they do greatly improve ship performance. In order to use any of the implants listed in this guide, you will need to have the Cybernetics skill trained to at least level V. This will allow you to use 6% implants, which can be purchased with Concord Loyalty Points (LP) earned by running Incursions. These implants can be found at Concord Stations and cost 250 million ISK and 250,000 LP.


Skill progression

For the most part skill progression is as simple as just topping off the minimum skills you needed to get ready and perhaps train a couple of new skills to be able to use a different set of drones or a situational module. There are however some differences between skill progression for logistics and damage dealers.

Logistics

Progression for logistics is practically an intertwined mess of both fit and skill progression, as skills like Logistics Cruisers V and all the support skills all play a vital role. The more powerful tech two remote shield boosters require better fitting skills and utility modules require more cap, at the same time you want to use less fitting modules to free up room for even more utility modules while still keeping a good enough tank.

See minimum and recommended skills for a list of specific skills to train early on to quickly move into the recommended and advanced logistics fits.

Icon implant hardwiring.png Implants

It's possible to change the priority or shorten the train early on by using implants to improve your capacitor regeneration or fitting room. This is because logistics have relatively small capacitor capacity and even small changes can often make or break a fit. See recommended implants for more information.

Damage dealers

Most of the progression in terms of skill for damage dealers surrounds gunnery and drones, but also to some extent capacitor management and fitting skills. Skill progression for damage dealers are completely disjointed and separate from ship progression due to the fact that you'll perform better in a pirate faction than you would in a tech one hull no matter what your skills are. So as your skills improve you'll progress the same regardless if it's in a fancy ship or your old but trustworthy tech one battleship; You simply upgrade when your skills allow you to.

See minimum and recommended skills for a list of specific skills to train early on.

Icon turret.png Tech two weapons

As soon as you have the skills for it, toss away those old meta turrets and replace them with your tech two turrets of choice. All ships, tech one battleships as well as pirate faction battleships benefit greatly from the much more powerful tech two turrets (and their advanced ammunition).

Icon drones.png Improved drone skills

There are several drone-related skills to help improve your performance. First improving drone control range, then general drone support and specialization skills. Later on you might train heavy drones for headquarter sites or sentry drones for vanguard sites.

Icon remote capacitor transmitter i.png Capacitor management

Some skills improve basic capacitor regeneration, others reduce capacitor usage instead. Some ships will have little to no issues with cap, while others are much more subject to it and require very high skills. Implants play a small role in this as well, so your mileage will vary here depending on your skills, ship, fit and implants.

Icon cpu.png Fitting skills

Long range weapons and propulsion modules in particular put a lot of strain on your power grid while tech two weapons and damage upgrades require a lot of CPU. This is not an issue early on, but as you move into assaults and headquarters, you might need to train skills that reduce the power grid and CPU requirements as well as improving the base output of your ship.

Planning ahead

Unless you are already heavily invested into a certain race or weapon system, it might be a good idea to think of which logistics ship, strategic cruiser or pirate faction battleship you'll want in the end, rather than what your first incursion ship should be. Don't worry too much about it though, as the race specific ship and weapon skills you train for the minimum skills only amount to a little over five days worth of training. So changing your mind along the way wouldn't be much of a detour.

Depending on the race, training for strategic cruisers will make quite some progress towards being able to fly logistics as well, or the other way around if your goal is to fly logistics. That said, most strategic cruisers pale in comparison to the pirate faction battleships who remain the epitome of incursion boats.

You should also consider secondary value of whatever you train, perhaps you can find an end-of-the-line ship that not only furthers your goals for incursions but other goals as well given the skills you'll end up training for it. If you already know that you like smaller ships, or have plans for diving into a wormhole in the future, it would make much more sense training into a strategic cruiser than a pirate faction battleship.

So take some time to consider which racial ship line, what racial weapons would benefit you doing missions, exploration, PvP or whatever else you'd like to do in EVE.