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User:Olly Wakwako/sandbox/Incursion Fitting Principles: Difference between revisions

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== Buying a pirate faction battleship ==
== Buying a pirate faction battleship ==
In almost all cases, upgrading your hull should be your first goal if you're looking to invest more ISK. Generally speaking for hisec, while faction and deadspace modules are great, pirate faction hulls often give superior bonuses without inflating the value of droppable modules fit to your ship. In the case of Incursions specifically, the matter comes down to the pirate faction battleships having two damage bonuses and powerful role bonuses (instead of having an offensive and a defensive bonus), plus much better overall ship stats such as align time.
Below is a list of some of the differences (relevant to incursions) for a [[Vindicator]] compared to a Hyperion, a [[Machariel]] compared to a Maelstrom, and a [[Nightmare]] compared to a Praxis.
{| class="wikitable" style="font-size:90%;"
|- style="background-color: #222222;"
! Improvements
! Hyperion » Vindicator
! Maelstrom » Machariel
! Praxis » Nightmare
|-
| {{icon|turret new|24}} Effective turrets<small>&nbsp;<ref name="turrets">'''Effective turrets''' is a measure of raw turrets modified by rate of fire or damage bonuses of the hulls as well as role bonuses.</ref></small>
| {{co|lightgreen|+22,2% more damage}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+9,4% more damage}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+33,3% more damage}}
|-
| {{icon|tracking|24}} Tracking speed
| {{co|lightgreen|+37,5% more tracking}}
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+37,5% more tracking}}
|-
| {{icon|range|24}} Turret falloff
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+50% more falloff}}
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
|-
| [[image:Icon capacitor capacity.png|24px|link=]] Capacitor recharge<small>&nbsp;<ref name="cap">'''Peak recharge''' is a measure of capacitor capacity / capacitor recharge time * 2,5 (peak coefficient). See [[Capacitor_Recharge_Rate|capacitor recharge rate]] for more information.</ref></small>
| {{co|lightgreen|+14,3% capacitor recharge}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+4,7% capacitor recharge}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+17,8% capacitor recharge}}
|-
| {{icon|shield|24}} Shield hit points
| {{co|lightgreen|+16,7% more shield hp}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+16,5% more shield hp}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+62,3% more shield hp}}
|-
| {{icon|sig|24}} Signature
| {{co|lightgreen|17,5% smaller signature}}
| {{co|lightgreen|23,9% smaller signature}}
| {{co|lightgreen|20,4% smaller signature}}
|-
| {{icon|range|24}} Targeting range
| {{co|lightgreen|20,8% longer lock range}}
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
| {{co|lightgreen|37,1% longer lock range}}
|-
| [[image:icon_drones.png|24px|link=]] Drone capacity
| {{co|crimson|-50 m3 drone bay}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+25 m3 drone bay}}
| {{co|crimson|-150 m3 drone bay}}
|-
| {{icon|sensor resolution|24}} Scan resolution
| {{co|crimson|-9,1% scan resolution}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+38,9% scan resolution}}
| {{co|crimson|-15,2% scan resolution}}
|-
| [[image:icon_warp_speed.png|24px|link=]] Warp speed
| {{co|grey|Same}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+1 AU/s warp speed}}
| {{co|grey|Same}}
|-
| {{icon|inertia|24}} Inertia
| {{co|lightgreen|+29,7% more agile}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+29,4% more agile}}
| {{co|crimson|-18,0% less agile}}
|-
| [[image:icon_velocity.png|24px|link=]] Velocity<ref>A ship's '''velocity''' is unimportant in Vanguards, but valued in Assaults and Headquarters, which involve moving with microwarpdrives to anchor positions.</ref>
| {{co|lightgreen|+14,7% faster}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+71,3% faster}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+52,0% faster}}
|}
<small><references/></small>


== Faction and deadspace modules ==
== Faction and deadspace modules ==
Line 421: Line 350:
<small><references/></small>
<small><references/></small>


== Command Ships and Strategic Cruisers ==
{{quote|These ships are not ships you train into for for the sake of doing incursions as a damage dealer ...}}
Cruiser-sized hulls like '''Command Ships''' and '''Strategic Cruisers''' are less powerful with their weaker medium weaponry and sometimes low number of utility midslots. A lot of these ships also have some issues with range projection, even when using long range weapons. Unlike regular tech one battleships, they also focus on skills that make little to no headway towards the more powerful pirate faction battleships.


Given their lower dps potential, these ships also require very high skills (near max) and tech two guns to be able to perform. These ships are not ships you train into for the sake of doing incursions, with the exception of the [[Roles in Incursions#Ongrid booster|ongrid booster role]], but used as an alternative if you can't fly battleships and you happen to have these trained high already.
= Fit progression =


===== Ill-suited for public communities =====
In almost all cases, upgrading your hull should be your first goal if you're looking to invest more ISK. Generally speaking for hisec, while faction and deadspace modules are great, pirate faction hulls often give superior bonuses without inflating the value of droppable modules fit to your ship. In the case of Incursions specifically, the matter comes down to the pirate faction battleships having two damage bonuses and powerful role bonuses (instead of having an offensive and a defensive bonus), plus much better overall ship stats such as align time.
Almost all communities shun these two ship classes (with the exception of command ships for [[Roles in Incursions#Ongrid booster|ongrid boosting]]). Instead they favour having their members temporarily go into the tech one battleships, until they can afford to upgrade to the more powerful pirate faction battleships. Any other ship class is just a waste of time and effort better put into getting them skilled and ready in the appropriate high-end ships they desire, since people make enough ISK to upgrade to a proper pirate faction ship after just a handful of hours worth of running.


===== Accepted in the EVE University Incursion Community =====
Below is a list of some of the differences (relevant to incursions) for a [[Vindicator]] compared to a Hyperion, a [[Machariel]] compared to a Maelstrom, and a [[Nightmare]] compared to a Praxis.
In the [[EVE University Incursion Community]] we have no real reason to casually bar these ships as regular damage dealers, since properly fitted with long range medium turrets they can often perform similar to or slightly better than our tech one minimum fits. They can also be used effectively for [[Nation Consolidation Network]] assault sites. Since we have some members who spend the majority of their time in other [[communities]] flying smaller ships, this allows us to include more people into our community.
{| class="wikitable" style="font-size:90%;"
|- style="background-color: #222222;"
! Improvements
! Hyperion &raquo; Vindicator
! Maelstrom &raquo; Machariel
! Praxis &raquo; Nightmare
|-
| {{icon|turret new|24}} Effective turrets<small>&nbsp;<ref name="turrets">'''Effective turrets''' is a measure of raw turrets modified by rate of fire or damage bonuses of the hulls as well as role bonuses.</ref></small>
| {{co|lightgreen|+22,2% more damage}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+9,4% more damage}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+33,3% more damage}}
|-
| {{icon|tracking|24}} Tracking speed
| {{co|lightgreen|+37,5% more tracking}}
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+37,5% more tracking}}
|-
| {{icon|range|24}} Turret falloff
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+50% more falloff}}
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
|-
| [[image:Icon capacitor capacity.png|24px|link=]] Capacitor recharge<small>&nbsp;<ref name="cap">'''Peak recharge''' is a measure of capacitor capacity / capacitor recharge time * 2,5 (peak coefficient). See [[Capacitor_Recharge_Rate|capacitor recharge rate]] for more information.</ref></small>
| {{co|lightgreen|+14,3% capacitor recharge}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+4,7% capacitor recharge}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+17,8% capacitor recharge}}
|-
| {{icon|shield|24}} Shield hit points
| {{co|lightgreen|+16,7% more shield hp}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+16,5% more shield hp}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+62,3% more shield hp}}
|-
| {{icon|sig|24}} Signature
| {{co|lightgreen|17,5% smaller signature}}
| {{co|lightgreen|23,9% smaller signature}}
| {{co|lightgreen|20,4% smaller signature}}
|-
| {{icon|range|24}} Targeting range
| {{co|lightgreen|20,8% longer lock range}}
| {{co|grey|Similar}}
| {{co|lightgreen|37,1% longer lock range}}
|-
| [[image:icon_drones.png|24px|link=]] Drone capacity
| {{co|crimson|-50 m3 drone bay}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+25 m3 drone bay}}
| {{co|crimson|-150 m3 drone bay}}
|-
| {{icon|sensor resolution|24}} Scan resolution
| {{co|crimson|-9,1% scan resolution}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+38,9% scan resolution}}
| {{co|crimson|-15,2% scan resolution}}
|-
| [[image:icon_warp_speed.png|24px|link=]] Warp speed
| {{co|grey|Same}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+1 AU/s warp speed}}
| {{co|grey|Same}}
|-
| {{icon|inertia|24}} Inertia
| {{co|lightgreen|+29,7% more agile}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+29,4% more agile}}
| {{co|crimson|-18,0% less agile}}
|-
| [[image:icon_velocity.png|24px|link=]] Velocity<ref>A ship's '''velocity''' is unimportant in Vanguards, but valued in Assaults and Headquarters, which involve moving with microwarpdrives to anchor positions.</ref>
| {{co|lightgreen|+14,7% faster}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+71,3% faster}}
| {{co|lightgreen|+52,0% faster}}
|}
<small><references/></small>


While we accept them, they are still '''not recommended''' for the majority of players as they require very high skills and tech two weapons to perform. They should only be used for very specific reasons when other alternatives are much less desirable.


= Fit progression =
For the most part, fit progression is really only relevant for high-end ships like the three pirate faction battleships mentioned above. Logistics ships use pretty much the same rigs, changing only a few modules based on their desired fit. Remember that upgrading from a regular battleship to a pirate faction battleship alone is a big upgrade and the best use of your ISK for the initial upgrade.
For the most part, fit progression is really only relevant for high-end ships like the three pirate faction battleships mentioned above. Logistics ships use pretty much the same rigs, changing only a few modules based on their desired fit. Remember that upgrading from a regular battleship to a pirate faction battleship alone is a big upgrade and the best use of your ISK for the initial upgrade.


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